Jennifer Levin
Hi everyone and welcome to Untethered: Healing the pain from a sudden death. I am Dr. Jennifer Levin, and I specialize in traumatic death and helping individuals through the struggles, pain, trauma, and chaos of an unexpected death. In today’s podcast I interview Martinique Brown, a 34-year-old woman living in Southern California whose husband was killed in a single person car accident. Marti tells the story of how she learned about her husband’s death, her difficult struggle with traumatic grief and the complications she faced after learning about her husband’s betrayal during their marriage. She also discusses the lack of resources available for young adults coping with grief and the impact COVID had on her grieving experience. Now her life has changed dramatically and she is involved in a new relationship and is well on her path to healing.
Marti, why don't you start off and tell us a little bit about yourself.
Marti
So I am 34 years old. I live in Southern California in the LA area. I work in local government for the city of Pasadena. I work in human resources. Outside of work. I'm a daughter, granddaughter, sister, aunt, girlfriend, and friend. So I pretty much spend most of my free time filling those roles.
Jennifer Levin
Okay, what are some of the things that you like to do?
Marti
I am a very big foodie, so I love eating, finding new restaurants and trying out new foods. When I can, I like to travel. Outside of that, I watch a lot of TV, tick tock. And I like doing yoga and working out when I can.
Jennifer Levin
Oh, good for you. Okay. So can you share with us what happened to your husband?
Marti
Um, so, back in 2019. Me and my husband, Ryan, we were living down in North San Diego County in a city called Oceanside, which is about 45-50 minutes north of actual downtown San Diego. And so on that night, he had to go to a work conference down in downtown San Diego. So he called me, I don't know, maybe four or five o'clock while I was still at work to let me know that he was driving down that way to go there for the evening. So that was actually the last time we spoke to each other. He went to the conference, and I think there was a dinner and drinks and all that involved. And I just went home after work and did my regular routine and went to bed. I didn't think to check in or anything. I just figured he'd be home when he got home. But I woke up the next morning and he hadn't returned home. He wasn't home. So I was worried. I was alarmed. I didn't know what to think. I texted and called, no response. But um, yeah, I really didn't know what to think at that point. So I just did my best to get ready for work. I went to work that morning. But I really couldn't concentrate at work. I stayed maybe till like nine or 10 o'clock. And I just had to leave. I told my boss I had a family emergency and had to go home. So when I did get back home, there was actually a business card on my front gate from I don't know, some kind of police officer or somebody I don't remember, but it had a note written on the back to call them and a phone number. So I did call them back. And then that's when they explained to me that he had gotten in a car accident and had passed away earlier that morning, I think like around 2am, driving back home. So it turns out I guess he was intoxicated, and he got in a car accident. It was just him by himself. He had ran through a tree. The tree didn't stop him. There was some kind of like hill behind the tree or little embankment that the car went down, and it flipped over. And then it caught on fire. And I guess the whatever the report, it showed that he didn't actually have any injuries from the accident. He actually died from smoke inhalation. So he was still alive when the car had caught in flames and he died in the car that way.
Jennifer Levin
Wow.
Marti
Yeah.
Jennifer Levin
Wow. What happened after that when you learned
Marti
so after that I was on my own. I mean, we were living down in Oceanside. And it was just the two of us out there. His family is on the east coast. That's where we had. We lived previously. to Oceanside. We had moved from the East Coast. And then my family is all in the LA area. So about two hours away. So when it first happened, I was by myself. I called my mom right away, let her know what happened, called his parents. And then my mom dropped everything to come and be with me, but I still had a few hours for her to get there. So we had some next door neighbors that we weren't too close with, but they were the only people in the complex that I really knew they were the realtors who helped us get the place. So I went next door. And I told them what happened and I just sat with them for a moment because I just didn't know what to do. But then it just felt weird, I didn't want to just be there for hours just crying on the couch. So I just left and walked around. I just sat outside on the curb, I really didn't want to be inside by myself. So I just sat outside and waited for my mom to come. And then everything from there. And so now it's kind of a blur. It just kind of happened. Yeah.
Jennifer Levin
Do you remember the early stages of your grief and what it was like?
Marti
Yeah, it was just inescapable, I guess. Just from the second I found out he was gone, just where like the floor falls out from under you. And there's just nowhere to go. Like every second, you're just like, This pain is here. And there's no way to get away from it. It was also complicated, I would say, for me in the beginning, like very early on, maybe within the first week or so, I found out that he hadn't been faithful through our whole marriage, like going through his computer and getting access to those things. I did find out some things. I don't know the extent or all the details, I still have millions of questions. But that definitely added to all my feelings, just feeling betrayed and sad. I felt a lot of anger, but then just all these feelings mixed together and then feeling guilty for feeling those feelings. It was just a mix a real mix of feelings.
Jennifer Levin
Wow. First of all, thank you so much for sharing all that. But you know, you brought up what so many people experience after a sudden loss. So many unknown questions, a mix of so many complicated emotions, whatever it may be, but, and then guilt for feeling a lot of the emotions that come up. So whether it be anger, betrayal, some of the things you talked about. And then once you start to feel that way, then you start to feel guilty for feeling the emotions that you start to feel. So I'm really glad that you that you touched on that. Was this the first person in your life that had ever died?
Marti
It wasn't the first person I did lose my paternal grandparents. I grew up with both set of grandparents. So I was close with them. My paternal grandmother passed away when I was in elementary school, and then my paternal grandfather, in my early 20s When I was in grad school, so I did lose a vote for them. But it was definitely a very different feeling.
Jennifer Levin
Absolutely, absolutely. How did your life change after your husband died?
Marti
Pretty much everything changed. Like I said, the two of us were living down in Oceanside. And it was just the two of us out there. We were already on the brink of change with our living situation, because we were renting a condo. And the owner had informed us that he was planning on selling it. So we had like, two months or so when we had to be out of that place. So we were in the process of looking at apartments and other condos, trying to find where we could move to, we were also toying with the idea of, you know, seeing if it was time for us to buy a house. So we had been going to open houses. So just trying to figure out our next move. But we hadn't finalized anything. So we didn't have any plans. But I did have to get out of that place. So I had to decide if I wanted to find a place down in Oceanside by myself and go back to my job and just kind of pick up my life there. But I decided it was best for me to be with my family. So I left that condo, left my job and I moved up here to LA with my parents, moved in with them. I pretty much had no job, no home, just living in a room at my parents house. And I didn't really lose any friends, I would say, but I definitely cut myself off from everybody for a long time and was just in that room for a very, very long time.
Jennifer Levin
Were your friends supportive? Did they know how to support you is probably the better question to ask you.
Marti
I would say they were supportive. They definitely reached out and you know, asked me if I needed help or anything they could do but I was very closed off like I really didn't want to speak with anyone. So I really didn't let anybody in.
Jennifer Levin
Yeah. What changed? When did you decide to let people in?
Marti
I think it was really just time. Nothing necessarily changed. I was just in that room like I said for so long. This was 2019 and then going into 2020 with the pandemic and quarantine. Yes, so I was kind of already just in this hole by myself, and then the pandemic hit. And I was just deeper in this hole. So I think just eventually I started wanting to talk or just like, get that socialization with people just over time eventually.
Jennifer Levin
How did the pandemic impact your grieving process?
Marti
I mean, honestly, I don't think it really had that big an impact when I think about it, because I was just already, literally in this room at my parents house not going out, not talking to anybody. So I was already in my own quarantine, when the pandemic hit. I guess the only thing would be my few interactions with people because I did really get into yoga. When I moved with my parents, that was like my one field trip out of the house going to yoga, and then also the different therapy, things I tried out. So those were my interactions with other people. And so the pandemic kind of cut that off. Yeah, so that was the only real impact I felt.
Jennifer Levin
I was gonna ask you about that. Did you seek out or it sounds like you did tell us about the type of help that you that you sought out?
Marti
So I tried a lot of different things. In the beginning, I tried. I think it was called EMDR. Yeah, EMDR therapy, which I think is like focused specifically on trauma. And that did not work for me. I tried him two different therapists that did that.
Jennifer Levin
Can you describe what EMDR is?
Marti
Yeah, I don't really know the exact science behind it. But I guess it's something where there's like these visual things that are supposed to distract your mind and somehow to help with the trauma. But when the when I did, there was like this little light sensor bar. So the lights would move left to right, different directions. And then you also had these, I don't know things that you held in your hand that vibrated. So there's just different things, your eyes are watching the light, and then these things are vibrating in your mind. And then the therapist is asking you questions and getting you to think, and somehow it's supposed to all line up, I guess a distraction from what you're thinking and help with the trauma. But that didn't work for me.
Jennifer Levin
So it's different from talk therapy. EMDR, in terms of it gives you different ways to focus on a trauma, or different ways to process a trauma, using different things to focus on such as light, or different types of every EMDR therapist practices it differently. Some have you do counting or different intellectual types of exercises, to process the trauma by focusing on different objects or things instead of talk therapy, and I am not trained in EMDR. So I did not do a good way of explaining it. But some people find it excellent as a way and for some people it's not very beneficial. So it sounded like that didn't work for you.
Marti
Yeah.
Jennifer Levin
Okay, so what else did you try?
Marti
Um, so I did also do just regular talk therapy with a few different therapists, but one I worked with for the longest. She was really, I don't know, she, I made the best connection with her. So we worked together for a while. And then I think she was the one who actually recommended me to you somehow. And I did your support group for a while,
Jennifer Levin
So you participated in a traumatic grief support group?
Marti
Yeah, with you. And then I also did just a regular, like at a local hospital, grief group that was people from different ages and different experience who has different people, so just kind of an open support group. And then my mother in law on the East Coast, she had done some kind of nationwide support group that's faith based and they have like a workbook that you work from. So that had really helped her so I tried doing that they had a group out here. That didn't work at all. I also did just regular, a regular support group that was just depression focused. Yeah, it was just depression, a depression support group, but not necessarily grief. Um, I did other things. I went and saw a medium, a psychic medium, trying to like get help that way. Yeah, I'm sure there was more stuff. I tried a lot of stuff. But the talk therapy, I would say with that one therapist that I saw the longest that was the most beneficial.
Jennifer Levin
the most beneficial for you. Okay. How would you describe your grief now? So it's been about three and a half years? Yeah. How would you describe it now?
Marti
I would say it's definitely still there. But I don't know how to explain it. I guess it's like the volume is just turned down somehow. When I think about it, I kind of think about it like a room. And before it was just decorated with grief, just everywhere, grief, everywhere I looked and nowhere to escape it. And now it's like, the grief is maybe like in a box, somewhere in the room. So it's still there. And I can still look at it. And it's still like, I can still go to it. It's not locked up in the closet somewhere. I'm not trying to ignore it. It's just not out there. I'm not thinking about it every day, it's not the first thing on my mind every day. There's other things that the room is decorated with now.
Jennifer Levin
That's a really nice analogy. So unfortunately, people lose a loved one suddenly every day. But not a lot of people your age experience a sudden loss. I'm curious, how do you think being so young impacted your grief?
Marti
I think the hardest thing, it just made it hard for me to find people like me, I guess not that I necessarily searched that hard. But when I did meet other people, it would be older couples that lost a spouse, someone who had been married for years, or someone who had children with the person. Just different situations that didn't relate to me, I never found someone in my exact same situation who was recently married. No kids, just starting to build a life with someone. And that all being taken away. So yeah, I just never found someone in my exact situation that I could relate to. I was able to bond with people over just the pain of losing someone, but not being able to really relate and talk about our exact situation and how it impacted us.
Jennifer Levin
Yeah. And that's one of the reasons I was so pleased you were willing to come and talk on this podcast is because there are so many people, believe it or not, in your situation in your age group. And I know your willingness to share your story today is going to mean so much to them. I'm also curious how being so young impacted your view, about life in general in the world, you know, something so traumatic, you know, betrayal, abandonment, and all of that, how it impacted your worldview.
Marti
So I will say at first, it gave me a very dark outlook, I was very much of the idea, just always thinking that nothing mattered. That's what really was on my mind for a long time and nothing mattered. Everybody's gonna die. You can't trust anybody. You don't know anything about anybody. All you got in this world is yourself. Even my family is gonna die. Like it was just very dark outlook. And I feel like I still think that way, but it has made me cherish the time I do have with people more because I do recognize nothing's promised, like, my mom could die this afternoon. I don't know something bad could happen. I never know. I'm always waiting for the next thing to happen. Like expecting like, when is the next person in my life gonna die? When is this next thing going to hit me? So when I do spend time with my family and friends, I do try to cherish those times and really focus on being in that moment.
Jennifer Levin
Yeah. You and I talked before our interview today and you are gracious and shared with me that you're now in another relationship. My first question for you is, did you ever think you would be in another relationship again?
Marti
Um, honestly, yeah, I didn't think I would be. I didn't think about it too much. It wasn't really a concern of mine. Whether or not I would get into another relationship. Yeah, I wasn't doubtful that it would happen. It was just more of when or when I would be ready. And it did. It did happen.
Jennifer Levin
That's wonderful. What is it like to date again, while part of you is still grieving.
Marti
So, like, my whole grieving process is complicated, complicated feelings, I would say first and foremost, it's been a happy experience, it's definitely been a good experience, my boyfriend is a great guy. I'm very lucky, I feel very blessed to have met him and to have him in my life. And it's really been a turning point for me as far as just feeling more joy and happiness in life again. So it's definitely been a happy feeling dating him. But then also complicated, because I am still grieving. And I'm still thinking about my husband, and I still have sad days. And I would say, I would think most people going into a new relationship aren't really going to bring up their past relationships, talk about their exes, or this talk about that past person, like you're focused on the new relationship. So just in this case, it's not like we broke up, we didn't decide to see other people, we didn't decide we didn't want to be in on different relationships. Like, that relationship was just taken away from me. And he was my friend, too. It's like I lost a friend, and it's like, I feel at times, I can't talk about that. I don't want to always be talking about my husband, who passed away in this new relationship, but it's like I literally lost one of my best friends. And now it's like, I feel like I can't talk to talk about him with my new partner. So it's just kind of conflicting feelings.
Jennifer Levin
Yeah. Well, there's a lot that's been written about. After you start dating again, you're actually in a relationship with three people, you know, yourself, your husband who's died and your new partner. And so you've got to figure out all how to do all of those things. So I'm so happy to hear that you have found happiness again. The last question I have for you is, what advice do you have for individuals, and especially young adults who've recently experienced a sudden death.
Marti
I would say, my really only advice is to just keep holding on that it can get better. I don't have any tips or tricks to help you get there. But if you can just keep holding on, then there's a possibility for brighter days, if you could just see my story as an example. I never could imagine that I'd be happy again. And I thought I would be stuck in my parents house forever. In that room. I didn't think I would get a new job. I applied to so many jobs, hundreds of jobs. But now here I am with a new job. I moved out of my parents house about five months ago, and now living with my boyfriend. So yeah, things got better. And I never imagined or I couldn't see myself in this place. I was in a very, very dark hole for a very, very long time. And I can't say I, I had a number of days where I woke up and I was like, dang I woke up again, like I wish I didn't wake up. But I'm glad I got here. I somehow got through each day. And I got here. So if you could just keep getting through each day, somehow, whatever you need to do to get through it. Then there is hope for the future.
Jennifer Levin
That's great. Thank you again, so much for sharing with all of us today. I'm so glad that you're here. Thank you again, Marti, and we are so appreciative of you sharing your story. Thank you
When I first approached Marti about being a guest on my show, she was willing but reluctant stating “that she did not have anything remarkable to share.” Upon talking further with Marti, I shared with her that she did indeed have remarkable things to share. Marti had experienced an unthinkable tragedy when her husband was taken from her suddenly and her whole world as she knew it disappeared overnight. Marti struggled with grief related to the death of her husband, the infidelity in their marriage and her new reality without a job and living back home with her parents. But she sought help. She kept going and she did not give up even when it got really, really hard. Marti was grieving her husband’s death as a young adult and there were not a lot of support services for a young person who had experienced a traumatic loss. She also spent a lot of her time grieving during COVID when it was
difficult to connect to a community which can be so vital to the healing process. I truly believe Marti has a remarkable to story and is a role model for other young adults living with a sudden death. I am so grateful to her and all my guests who allow themselves to become vulnerable and seen when I interview them about one of the most painful experiences in their life in service to help podcast listeners heal as well.
If you want an opportunity to connect with Marti please join our Facebook group “Talking about the Podcast Untethered with Dr. Levin.” Marti’s contact information is available if you would like to connect with her.
Our next podcast will be on January 4th and will feature Michelle Post, who is a traumatic grief therapist. Michelle shares how she works with clients as a therapist and some of her grief experiences that have had a profound impact on who she is today.
Thank you so much for joining today’s episode of Untethered Healing the Pain After a Sudden Death. For help with a sudden and unexpected loss, sign up for my free mini course, where I will teach you about the 3 Truths About Living With A Sudden and Unexpected Loss. Please visit www.fromgrieftogrowth.com to sign up.
